For example, an English person called Bob might introduce themselves as “Bob”, whereas an American person called Bob might introduce themselves as “Bahb”. (Sorry, don’t know the phonetic alphabet but hopefully you get my gist)

Should you pronounce those two people’s names the same, with your own natural accent, or should you copy how the person says their own name?

Edit: I specifically picked a generic English name with different pronunciation across different accents. I know my wording wasn’t great, sorry! Hopefully the edit is a bit clearer.

Context and other languages

When pronouncing a name from a different language, I firmly believe you should copy the pronunciation of the owner of that name, and not Anglicise the name unless asked to. I say this as a speaker of a language that English people regularly mispronounce and even insist to me that they know the correct pronunciation of my language.

  • CerebralHawks@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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    3 months ago

    If the name depends on an accent, I’d say yes, but only to an extent.

    A good example is the name Jesus. We tend to think of Christ, the Christian figure, when we read the name and think “Gee-zuhs.” But it’s a common Hispanic name and it’s pronounced “Heh-zoos.” Die Hard 3 made a joke about this. Samuel L. Jackson’s character is called Zeus. One of his people says “Hey, Zeus” and Bruce Willis’ character calls him “Jesus” but pronounces it the same. “Do I look Puerto Rican to you?!” Jackson cries out to him. “He said Jesus,” Willis says. “As in hey Zeus, shove a lightning bolt up your ass ZEUS!” Been ages since I watched it but I still remember that part.

    Asking people how to pronounce their names and asking them back, attempting to do so, if it’s fine, and not only listening to what they say, but reading their body language, is the way to go.

    I once knew a guy, can’t remember if he was Cambodian or Vietnamese, he didn’t give people his name because nobody could pronounce it correctly. I asked him to let me try. Took me a few tries, but I got it. Oddly I still remember it. Can’t fucking type it to save my life though. He did ask I still call him by the same name others do, so as not to create confusion, but he was happy I learned to say his name. And if it was just us, I could use it.

    • RBWells@lemmy.world
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      3 months ago

      This is my approach. You are gonna get a kind of Americanized version because I can’t help it, but:

      We have an Irinya in our department, soft r, I sounds like our long E - I am not gonna call her Irine! Soft R I am familiar with from Spanish, I’m sure it’s not spot on as she is Eastern European but close enough for her, she says it sounds right. One lady on our team can’t even hear what the R sounds like and can’t make the sound, she calls her eeReenya with the hard R. Still acceptable to Irinya, that’s what matters.

      If it’s some sounds I can’t pronounce, I’d ask what they want to be called if I can’t make those sounds but in general yes I try to pronounce people’s names as they do, to the extent I can.

  • cecilkorik@lemmy.ca
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    3 months ago

    I think the risk of that approach is that if you attempt to copy their accent too literally it can sound like mockery, especially if you are clumsy in your imitation. Like you’re breaking out of your own accent on purpose because you think their name spoken in their accent sounds silly, and by repeating it in an exaggerated way you’re demonstrating how silly it sounds to you, and that kind of response can be interpreted as mocking or sarcastic.

    I think it’s safer if you try to strike at most a middle-ground between your own accent and their pronunciation, use it as guidance for the sounds but still keep it clearly in your own voice. When somebody has an accent I expect my name to be spoken at least to some degree in that same accent, so it’s not going to need to be an exact facsimile of the sounds I made.

    That’s my thoughts anyway, as a native English speaker.

  • wolframhydroxide@sh.itjust.works
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    3 months ago

    As a classroom teacher for students who are >80% immigrants from non-anglophone countries, I can actually speak with some authority on the subject. I have many students who have traditional names in other languages, as well as students whose parents 100% just made up something they thought sounded nice. I am one of the few teachers who emphasises correctly pronouncing students’ names. If they put stress on the second syllable, I put stress on the second syllable. If they have a non-english phoneme, you bet I’m learning how to do the clicks in Xhosa, or the “ng” in Vietnamese or Maori. I work very hard to make sure I’m pronouncing their names exactly how they do.

    I have had three students in the last month alone remark on how I am the only teacher they’ve ever had who pronounced their name “right”. I have a student named Djibril who had extremely poor relationships with most of the teachers in the building, but who always does my work, and he straight up told me last year that it was because I am the only person in the entire school who actually pronounces his name correctly. Everyone else just calls him “juh-BRILL”, when he says it should be pronounced closer to “JEE-breel” (with a lilted r).

    Making sure you pronounce someone’s name how they pronounce their name can be extremely important to social relationships, and having an anglicised name attached to them against their will is often mentioned among memoirs of immigrants as one of the first and most alienating things to happen to them when they enter an anglophone country. It’s not about expecting others to cater to your weird name. It’s about people having a basic modicum of respect for the humanity of non-dominant cultures. In america, at least, this respect has never been a thing. From Ellis island literally changing people’s names because they thought they would be hard for “real” Americans to pronounce, to interning anyone with a japanese name regardless of how long their family was in the US, to the new fascist roundups of anyone with a name that sounds plausibly nonwhite.

    So, even with different “accents”, I’d say that pronouncing it exactly how they say it can be important. If someone in Germany went to the trouble of pronouncing the ‘w’ in my name with an american “w”, I’d appreciate it, at the least, but it would probably also make me remember them fondly every time someone else pronounced it incorrectly accented.

  • crypto@sh.itjust.works
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    3 months ago

    My name is unpronounceable for most non-native French speakers. I tell them to not even try, as there are sounds in French that don’t exist in English. Instead, I introduce myself by butchering my own name, or by using the English equivalent to my name.

    So, no, I don’t think people should use an accent of the origin language of a name. You can try, and I’ll even rate you on a scale of 10, but I don’t expect you to not butcher my name anyway.