Yeah. I actually think your comment was very insightful, thank you

I knew it

run your own AI model

What AI model could you run locally on a decade old phone though? Probably nothing too sophisticated. It would have to be like ChatGTP 2 or something which doesn’t do a great job of holding a conversation

I’ve tested my local AI and it’s almost indistinguishable from humans in communication style

Why are AIs like ChatGTP so easy to spot then? Is it just the fine tuning?

Please don’t reply to this comment

What so you mean by ‘webs of trust’? Can you elaborate?

Have you even read the article were discussing?

It’s not an over-simplification that’s literally just what its called. See: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Assisted_suicide

We already have a very dysfunctional healthcare system. It’s a real concern that people might turn to MAID because they cannot access healthcare. The article linked above cites at least one example of this. I think this concern is even greater with mental health cases, since our mental healthcare system is even more dysfunctional. Why are we offering MAID for people with mental health issues when we can barely offer proper healthcare for people with mental health issues? That’s a legitimate concern. If you want to frame that concern as me being as a nosey person who wants people to live in suffering then you can, but that’s not a very productive way to hold this conversation.

It is quite literally assisted suicide though

Yes. In addition to the environmental costs there is the very real financial costs. Th cost of building and maintaining our roads is causing municipal debt to skyrocket across North America, which results in reduced services elsewhere, like cuts to community centres or schools. Theres a very good book on this topic called You’ll Pay For This which I recommend to anyone interested in city politics

By that logic I am deciding when an arbitrary number of people die by choosing not to kill them. I guess theres a sense in which thats technically correct, but it seems like its stretching the terminology a bit

I have hope. There are ways to design the front-end that smooth over the technical aspects for non-technical users. The mastodon sign-up page is a good example of this.

You are correct. I don’t trust people to decide when other people should die.

Other countries do make these decisions

Yes I know. I said nearly every other country does without it, but it is true that some countries do have similar programs.

If you read my other comment in this thread it should be clear that I think MAID due to being poor is not acceptable at all

In some ways then, you and I have very similar views. I guess one of our main differences is how much confidence we have in the current system to make it so that the poor are not disproportionately suffering as a consequence of MAiD. I don’t trust our current system to do that. Our current healthcare system is already so broken, especially for the mentally ill, so there’s a real danger that MAiD will be seen as a real alternative to proper healthcare. If we were in a place where we already had adequate care for people suffering from mental illnesses, then maybe we would be having a different discussion. But we are not there yet.

Thank you for your thoughtful comment. This thread has triggered a lot of emotions and devolved into nastiness in some parts so it was refreshing to read something well put together and measured like this

If you were suicidal the day they go to do it then you’d be disqualified.

If someone is not suicidal the day they go to do it then they won’t go through with it. Why would you choose to die if you don’t want to die? I don’t understand this sentence.

it seems to me that if were having trouble rolling out healthcare then we should focus on improving healthcare, not introducing MAiD. MAiD is not an alternative to proper mental healthcare, but I guess that’s what you’re saying?

That’s what the medical team is for. They don’t just tell you to kill yourself because you had a bad day.

Never suggested they did. But in the end they do end up killing people solely because they have a mental illness (assuming the expansion of MAiD goes through). There’s a reason why the UN considers this state sponsored eugenics. Very few other democratically run countries have done this since eugenics went out of fashion.

failed suicide attempts are rarely clean or lead to deep reflection

So instead of focusing on suicide prevention we should just get our doctors to finish the job for them?

edit: that probably wasn’t the best wording. things have been getting a bit feisty in this thread and i feel the opposition coming in hot so i got defensive. i know you think ive misrepresented how maid works but i dont think i have. granted i havent gone into detail about the vetting and how its a long process etc but i assumed thats because we are all on the same page. there is one thing i havent misrepresented though and thats this: if this expansion goes forward, people will receive medical assistance in dying solely because they have a mental illness. i think this is a dangerous system and ripe for abuse; you dont, and you think its the merciful thing to do. thats fine, clearly we disagree. but if were to keep discussing this here, lets reign it in and keep it from getting nasty (im not saying im innocent in this department; i know im not).