Just a little thought I wanna discuss.
Unlike the more massive social media or the real world where theres not many leftists and we are gladly more united Lemmy and its left leaning tendencies with the instances providing natural cult grouping tendencies. Add to that the matrix in groups there and we all seem to be making a thing out of how to anger each other. How to troll each other or annoy x or y instance.
I hate this.
Living in an extreme right wing nation I know no other anarchist. A few left wingers. Even the libs here are right wing extremists by the standards of a western nation. I hold dear any solidarity.
I support unions here even when everyone there is a religious fundamentalist who wants sharia law bc they still qantnto improve the conditions of the working class.
Many folks here, who again I don’t have any hate for, I see intending these fights and dramas. Having the goal to be banned from x or y community or instance.
- Why!?!?
- What do you gain?
- What is the desire here??
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I’m not a fan of the infighting either. It’s a very online kind of tribalism. I’m pretty active in anarchist organizing where I live and routinely have people from all sorts of tendencies showing up to help out without it devolving into a struggle session over factional infighting from a hundred years ago.
Just from the time I’ve spent here it seems like it’s specifically the people occupying the centrist liberal positions who are most invested in fostering a culture of leftist infighting
I have tried to talk to anarchists here, as I feel there is potentially something to it, but it always ends up with “read this and shut up libtard”-like posts. A shame, we should welcome different opinions and angles seing things, not always try to “convert” everyone to some very specific thing. IMO.
you have been pretty anti-communist every time we’ve intracted, on top of calling me a tankie. not surprised you’re having trouble with people welcoming your different opinion
Oh I see, it is I who have to “welcome a different option”.
Most of “communism” here on lemmy is either hardcore stalin/lenin/mao authoritarian ruling or it is some sort of workers dictatorship. What’s not to criticise? And when you try to discuss you get downvoted and people act aggressively, or so I feel.
I also does not know what that has to do with anarchism?
Oh I see, it is I who have to “welcome a different option”.
reread my comment, not what I said. Maybe if you’re less quick to call people tankies you might not get called a liberal in response.
I consider a workers dictatorship to be a lesser evil compared to the dictatorship of capital we live in currently.
I also does not know what that has to do with anarchism?
To put it simply, anarchists want to abolish hierarchy, communists want to abolish private property. They overlap when you want both. Liberals tend to oppose dismantling both of those things.
PS. If you’re not a pro authoritarian please accept my apologies.
If you want to find out if they’re an actual tankie, just look for anything related to Russia or China. They out themselves pretty quick, usually.
Can you elaborate? has tankie been reduced to pejorative shorthand for ‘isn’t repeating the approved narrative’
Just read these 14 books from 1930 if you want to have an opinion. No, I can’t summarize anything from them. They can only be understood in their entirety.
All hail Putin, Xi.
Seems like a caricature rather than someone that’s actually around.
I really don’t see anyone of consequence on lemmy being like ‘no Putin is good actually.’
One example, I was reading a hexbear (allegedly tankie central) thread a while back where they were shitting on the CPRF for receiving praise from Putin for their support of the SMO. (ie saying that they were losers that lenin would have had shot, and that they’re not communist)
Talking of the tribalism. How come an anarchist is on .ml
Is the experience there OK?
It was the first lemmy account I set up and I haven’t bothered to change it! I had figured the developer instance would get updates the fastest. I like that it can access hexbear db0 and blahaj and I haven’t run into any issues beyond the occasional sectarian post.
I’m kind of surprised to not see this answer, so I’ll throw it in: it seems to me that there are a lot of people from various countries who have built-in language for politics that they believe is shared across the world - but it isn’t.
As a dumb American, I’ve always been a liberal because that was the inclusive, progressive, luxury-gay-space-communism option as opposed to the conservative, regressive, racist, ignorant violent option. People from other countries don’t seem to appreciate that at all, because their “liberal” is what we’d call neoliberal or corporate Democrat, and they apparently don’t have a FPTP / Slaver’s College fix on their elections and they just don’t grok the two party thing.
As you can imagine on here there’s a lot of hate from both conservatives and leftists for “liberals”. I think that’s ridiculous but it’s usually easier to try and adopt their definitions than to explain why the other 379,999,999 of us don’t use it that way. (Well - 350M, say. Parts of the PNW use it that way too.). It’s just kind of exhausting in threads about American politics.
If someone calls me a “liberal” (or libtard, libcuck, etc) I naturally assume they’re racist, fascist, AM radio fuckwits. But then they want to jump into some world where H4A, UBI, No Oil is what they’re all about and once again I’m like - well, yeah we agree, again. So.
(Usually the retort is, “well then why are you a liberal?!” Which. Goes back to the exhausting thing.)
Liberalism has an actual definition. Neoliberalism is a subset of liberalism. Either way, neither position is socialist and both are capitalist. That’s the distinction. That’s always been the distinction. Leftist politics is distinctly anti capitalist.
To leftists, liberalism, even progressive liberalism, can never address the material concerns for workers, inequal accumulation, and capitalism’s contradictions because it cannot attack the central tenet of its ideology: the private ownership of land and resources. And most of the social stuff was being advocated by leftist groups in the west for years before they became popular enough for the mainstream, liberal parties to embrace.
I’m an American. Conflating liberalism with leftism is a media game that has successfully ensured the Overton window does not shift left. It reveals the mass political ignorance here. Of the policies you’ve listed, only H4A is arguably socialist.
You can understand the two party system and make decisions to support certain candidates/policies in an election without identifying as a liberal.
In my experience, we don’t have quite that many leftists trying to rile each other up. What often happens is that some people want to character assassinate some others due to previous dislikes or because they oppose one of their core beliefs, so they try to blow up any “impurities” they can find in order to turn people against them. You can see it with people who get short term bans from leftist places and then get into year-long grudges.
Generally I would suggest people start ignoring people who constantly post and try to stir up drama about whole instances or specific subgroups of lemmy users. For example, I dislike intensely, like threads.net, hilariouschaos and lemmygrad and yet you don’t see me constantly opening drama threads about them.There’s some caveats in this statement, but it by and large, it applies imho.
Yeah ‘my honor has been slighted and so i must now escalate’ is quite common.
Character assassinations too.
But yesterday we had 2 fellow dbzer0 folks do this very trolling/ baiting. Which they also planned in the matrix channel. I think I instantly made clear I strongly disliked that. So did the community. And there was an apology luckily.
But we both know there’s one provocateur there. Who I personally always have had lovely chats with. But someone who likes to go looking for trouble.
And thats not an isolated case. Many similar profiles I’ve seen.
There’s a lot of .ml users that make accounts on db0 because so many instances blocked .ml and their users.
db0 also doesn’t do much to stop their instance from being abused like this.
What instances block .ml that I’d be upset to miss?
You have repeatedly made this claim but still haven’t given any proof after a few weeks.
Please demonstrate the users you believe are alts of .ml and other instances. Any and all of them.
Edit: After being asked 3 times, this time after 24 hours, still no response with any information. Good misinformation that .world allows to be spread.
Any examples?
I don’t think we’ll get any, she’s been asked before as hasn’t given any evidence before.
They’ve previously claimed other users are alts of me, which is especially funny considering I only use accounts with the same name for the sake of transparency.
0·2 months agoNo actually, I am your alt.
Oh shit, that’s news to me! 🫠
Guess I have an alternate personality that actually knows tech and can host awesome wesites like ComLib? News to me! Or, this personality of me?
Now this I haven’t seen at all
Libs claim tankies make sockpuppets in our instance, tankies claim libs make sockpuppets in our instance. It’s just inability to comprehend the anarchist perspectives
Ive never seen non anarchists capable of understanding the anarchist perspective. Its like theres some mental block preventing it.
And not just on Lemmy. Just generally, unimaginable idea for people
To be fair, some of us Marxist-Leninists used to be anarchists. That’s how I came to Marxism-Leninism, actually, so it isn’t that I misunderstand the anarchist viewpoint, I’ve just come to agree more with Marxists over time and after reading more theory from both.
Libs and tankies are both right-wingers masquerading as left. So they’re constantly locking horns over whose empire is better, whose glorious leader is more righteous, whose genocide (ukr/pal) is more the fault of the victims, etc. It’s as simple as this:
Youre an anarchist so I get seeing tankies as right wing. Infact I’m the weird one for not seeing them as right wing but i don’t.
Libs yes are righties
You’re correct. They aren’t right wing. They are communists.
I haven’t figured out if I’m fully anarchist, a “left libertarian” who can accept a restrained state, or if I’m coming around to being an ML, tbh.
And I’m not sure if I care. I just want capitalism dismantled and fascism/conservativism opposed. And I don’t want a police state.
But, and this is gonna be hypocritical of me, I feel like the sectarianism always seems to be coming from online anarchist and progressive spaces. Like no don’t join our mass movement against capitalism if you, IDK, don’t dislike China enough? Doesn’t make sense to me.
Tankies feel like they push pseudo communism with the bourgeoisie still at the top giving scraps to the proletariat and passing it off as paltry socialism. There’s no societal change to the hierarchy, balance of power, or wealth. Usually some power of personality to rally around as their God who’s surrounded themselves with oligarchs who are enriching themselves and providing scraps to pass off as communist enough.
It’s more a weird ultra nationalism where proletariats are being tricked into thinking power has been given to the people when the ones at top are abusing their power to oppress forms of counter thought to seize whatever they want and retain their wealth. I wouldn’t consider them left just because there’s some form of socialism. Lot of countries do if at the very least they fix roads and have fire fighters.
The integration of authoritarianism just conflicts with my idea of communism, since my idea of communism is power to the people and one where the government fears the people because people control the means of production and they choose who stays in power. Not trading the usual suspects of kings, dictators, warlords, or whatever they call themselves for a different coat of paint.
