• PugJesus@piefed.socialOPM
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    3 days ago

    Explanation: The Mongols were a very warlike people, but, in part due to the high level of endemic warfare in their own pre-unification society, took diplomatic immunity very seriously. Genghis Khan, memorably, sent merchants and emissaries to open normalized trade relations with the authorities of the massive Khwarizmi Empire in Central Asia - taking special care to send Muslim subjects to minimize the potential for any cross-cultural misunderstandings.

    The Khwarizimi authorities robbed the merchants, and killed the emissaries.

    Twice.

    The Mongols then invaded and utterly obliterated the Khwarizmi Empire in a lightning campaign that took only two years.

    … maybe don’t fucking execute diplomats, my Khwarizmi guy.

    • mojofrododojo@lemmy.world
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      2 days ago

      well, yeah, but also…

      it’s always about picking who gets to be violent, when, isn’t it? I have no doubt, emissaries or not, defiant Khwarizmis were gonna get treated violently by the mongols either way. It’s usually a part of the horde overrunning your nation, the pesky men on horses filling your families with arrows bit - which, yeah, is actually really violent, and the burning down of your house, and the rape of your livestock etc., etc., etc.,

      perhaps the Khwarizmi didn’t think they’d win the fight, but they could at least take out the assholes who brought the message.

      thermopylae/300 vibes to typing this out… but I don’t recall the ‘kicks emissary into pit’ part being historic…

      • PugJesus@piefed.socialOPM
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        2 days ago

        it’s always about picking who gets to be violent, when, isn’t it? I have no doubt, emissaries or not, defiant Khwarizmis were gonna get treated violently by the mongols either way. It’s usually a part of the horde overrunning your nation, the pesky men on horses filling your families with arrows bit - which, yeah, is actually really violent, and the burning down of your house, and the rape of your livestock etc., etc., etc.,

        Despite the reputation of the Mongols for warmongering, Genghis’s two biggest wars outside of Mongolia itself were against China, and against… the Khwarizmi.

        Considering that the war with China was still ongoing, it’s doubtful that Genghis was seeking a conflict with the Khwarizmi at the time, especially considering his genuine life-long interest in trade.

        perhaps the Khwarizmi didn’t think they’d win the fight, but they could at least take out the assholes who brought the message.

        The Mongols were a new and smaller nomadic power to the east engaged in a war with one of the Chinese dynasties. The Khwarizmi were one of the largest and most powerful states on the face of the planet.

        … I don’t think it was desperation which led them to execute two sets of diplomats and rob hundreds of Muslim merchants.

        thermopylae/300 vibes to typing this out… but I don’t recall the ‘kicks emissary into pit’ part being historic….

        Supposedly the Spartans threw him into a well. While also a violation of diplomatic immunity, they at least had the excuse that the Persians were requesting their vassalage.

    • Skullgrid@lemmy.world
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      2 days ago

      The europeans were so lucky that the great khan died when he did.

      or unlucky, depending on how you want to look at it.

      • smeg@feddit.uk
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        2 days ago

        We’ve had a thousand “what if the Nazis won WW2” alternate histories, are there any good stories or thought experiments covering what would happen if the Mongols conquered Europe?